Down the Health Rabbit Hole and Back with Coach Ken Kehs

Today's guest spent six years in the health rabbit hole before he learned the fix wasn't doing more, it was doing less. 

Coach Ken spent 25 years as an aerospace engineer and another decade running his own business consulting practice, building a reputation for getting things done, whatever it took. Then mold in a rental bathroom quietly derailed his health for six years. Normal labs. Normal pulmonary tests. Brain fog, fatigue, and weakness that didn't match anything on paper. It took functional health, nervous system work, and learning to regulate a limbic system stuck in fight or flight before he got his life back.

In this Meet Your Health Heroes episode, Ricky and Ken dig into what that six-year rebuild actually taught him about working with clients today, why the whole person (physical, mindset, emotional, and energetic) has to be on the table, and the counterintuitive shift Ken made in his own energy work. We also learn what Ken wishes he'd known before burning himself out chasing his old "lead, follow, or get out of the way" identity, and why he keeps steering clients back to the basics no matter how deep the rabbit hole gets.

In this episode:

• How six years of unexplained illness led Ken from aerospace engineering to holistic health coaching
• Why "put up a shield" might be the worst advice for protecting your energy
• The nervous system piece most practitioners skip when clients aren't improving
• What Ken wishes he'd told his younger, more intense self
• How Ken keeps inspired and motivated while learning new ways to support his clients

Connect with Coach Ken: 

rabbitholehealthcoaching.com 

Instagram & Facebook: @RabbitHoleHealthCoaching

Get my book The Fulfilled Practitioner for FREE: www.rbrar.com/tfpbook

Follow me on instagram: @fulfilledpractitioner

Follow me on Facebook: @drrickybrar

Set up a strategy call with me here: Schedule Here

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 1:32

Hey everyone, welcome back to the Fulfilled Practitioner Podcast. Today we're doing our special Meet Your Health Hero segment. This segment is all about spotlighting the practitioners who are not just creating an impact, but they're doing it with fulfillment, purpose, and authenticity. I've had the pleasure of meeting some of the most brilliant minds in this space and people who are truly changing the world, and we want to make sure they don't stay a best kept secret for much longer. So today we have one of my favorite people, Coach Ken. How's it going today? It's going well today, Ricky. Thanks so much for having me on. Oh, absolute pleasure, and I'm super excited to do this. I I love your mission. I love the amazing work you're doing. And uh let's dive into it here. So I'd love for you to introduce yourself to the audience. Uh, who are you and what do you do?

SPEAKER_00 2:17

Who am I? That's always a good question, right? When you ask somebody, who are you? Uh excuse me. Um I go by Coach Ken. I am a I work as a holistic health and wellness coach. And um, yeah, who am I? Yeah, you know, it's that's always an interesting question, you know. Who you know, we're we're all human beings, we're all here on this earth. You know, how do we show up? You know, what motivates us, you know, that that sort of thing. Um you know, how do we how do we play a role? What's the role we play in this world? Uh, because it's a world we're in for a while, and we do play some sort of role in it. And um mine has come to be um working with people reclaim their health. And that was never anything that was on my radar uh at any point in time until the time that it showed up.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Amazing. That's why I'm excited to interview you today because I I know a little bit about your background. I know the audience might not just yet, but uh, it's an amazing story. So I'll I'll definitely force you into some storytelling mode here. But I'd love to know what originally drew you into this functional world.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

Well, it it it the short answer is it was my own health journey. Uh, you know, my background is I spent uh nearly 25 years working as an aerospace engineer. Uh I burned out on that. I did had my own business, one uh had my own business doing business consulting for 10 years. And in that, you know, I was halfway through year two and I started hitting my year one projections, you know, end-of-year projections, like, okay, this is going well. And then my health started to go south. And, you know, couldn't figure out why. It was the classic, your labs look normal, your pulmonary tests look normal. I'm going, yeah, no, this is not normal. Um, and so most people are gonna wonder, you know, so I ended what happened was I had renovated a place that I was renting, and there was a lot of mold in the bathroom, which I really didn't pay much attention to, but eventually my body paid attention to it. And so it was a very lengthy journey from the quote diagnoses to being able to become physically active again was six years. Wow. Um, you know, it was the the brain fog, the constant fatigue, the weakness, the weird pains. Uh it it just it's not a fun ride. And so in that journey, there's a couple things that I had to do besides you know clean out the mycotoxins and restore systems. And I didn't do this on my own. I was, you know, at this point, I wasn't even still thinking about doing this. I was just, you know, wanting to get back to like, can I ever exercise again? You know, I'm in my like late 40s, and it's like, what's going on? And you know, from there I had to go into other things. I'm extreme, I'm intimately familiar with biological dentistry because that's part of what it took to bring me back around. Um, and even with all that, um, my limbic system, which controls our fight or flight mode, it was stuck in fight or flight. It was it was not budging. And so there's different pro programs, protocols out there, and that's what finally opened the rest of the door for me. And I still remember where I was sitting, you know, as the brain fog was clearing, the energy was coming back, and you know, I'm helping businesses make more money. And I went, yeah, no, this is not what I need to be doing. I need to find a way to help other people that are on these journeys that aren't getting answers. And so I immediately signed up as for a health coach.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

Amazing. And it's well, not amazing when you were going through it, but to be able to interpret that period in your life and make that decision, I know that's not uh an easy thing to do. And like what always comes to mind, and this is why I love doing what I do, is when I speak to practitioners, I I see their hero's journey, right? So if we know the hero's journey framework, uh, when we first are just living in our ordinary world, there's some sort of call to adventure. And for many of us, that call to adventure, including myself, is a personal health story. And then what happens instantly, and you said it too, is there's a refusal of the call, right? You're like, I don't really want to do this, like, this isn't really my world. But I find uh practitioners who have been through it, they they have a completely different vantage point and a completely different empathy for people who have experienced that over multiple years. And I love that you transformed the period of suffering into something meaningful and impactful to people. So definitely kudos to you. And I love the engineer background, which we'll definitely explore a little bit more because not much will get by you. I know you're very analytical, and uh you have a good way to catch some blind spots and places uh for people to get better. So I absolutely love that. Uh, who do you love working with most?

SPEAKER_00 7:13

I I really I like working with people who want to also learn um for two reasons. One is I like to teach, I like to share information, and also even more importantly, though, is for them to understand why they're being asked to do what they need to do to reclaim their health. Um, people want to know the why, they want to understand. And those are the ones that usually are more willing to put in the work when because it's not always an easy journey. Um, you know, I want to be clear about that. Depending where you're starting from, it can be very challenging. And so working with those folks, and you know, depending which pro even I have different programs, I tend to become friends with my clients during the time we're together. Because this, you know, most of these things aren't a one, two-month overnight, you're you're back up and you know, running a marathon or something like that by the time people come to see me. So um, yeah, and um, sorry, lost my train of thought there.

SPEAKER_01 8:16

No, no problem. Like it's uh it's a big point that you made there because uh like these people are are quite lonely on their journey, right? And when they know they're working with somebody who has also experienced a similar journey, and I love that you're realistic with the timeline as well, in terms of like how long it sometimes can take to start to see a shift, and you want to build that relationship over time, that's where the magic happens, and people want like the the real honest truth in terms of like timelines and realistic possibilities and all of that. So, like I'm I'm all for it. So that's uh that's amazing news there. And um I know that would it be right for me not to ask you this question because that's our theme of the podcast, but what does being a fulfilled practitioner mean to you?

SPEAKER_00 8:59

You know, that covers a couple of things because it's it's all a balance, right? Um, you know, fulfilled, you know, there's what do I need for like fulfillment for me? And that is to be helping people, you know, helping people move forward. And you know, fulfillment is you know, we all have a lifestyle, right? It's you know, so we all want to be able to maintain some sort of lifestyle. We want to maintain our own energy, our own enthusiasm. And then for you know, just seeing people make the transformation and you know, the the feedback when you know they're able to go play with their kids again when they weren't able to do that, they're able to spend time with other loved ones. Um, they're back doing the things that are important to them. And I spend a good deal of time at the very beginning finding out what's important to what's it here are your goals, what's your why? What's what why is this so important to you? And for just to see people realize that and then go away with the information. You know, I always do my best to say, okay, we do live in a fairly toxic world, so there are some things, strategies you can do that you want to put in place and make as lifestyle changes, and even some maintenance in today's world, um, is to like, you know, keep this going. I'm always here if you need me, but really I want to educate you and get you on the right path so that you don't need me.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Absolutely, right? And there's nothing more fulfilling than somebody who doesn't need you, as crazy as that is to say, right? And in our world, so uh that's creating true transformation. You're teaching people life skills, and yeah, I feel too many people their their top priority, not voluntarily, becomes health. But then health is like all they're ever thinking about. There's no purpose, there's no higher purpose other than getting better. And I experienced this myself, and there's nothing outside trying to work on the health, but sometimes to get the health benefit, you have to kind of go outside the box and go down to like what do you like to do? Like, do some of those things now, right? And some of them you don't have to leave your house for, some of them are you don't have to spend any money for as well. So pursue hobbies, these things are so vital in like the the long-term healing process. So I I I love that you focus there with each and every person that you work with. Uh, I love that from your background, like if we explore that again, so um, there's the engineering background, then you have the business consultant background as well. So, in those worlds, the definition of success is very different, right? In aerospace, like I can only imagine it's pretty high stakes, but it's also uh something that has a completely different focus in terms of what is the definition of success. In business consulting, you mentioned you could help businesses make more money, but maybe that wasn't as fulfilling for you. Has your definition of success changed over your career?

SPEAKER_00 11:44

Oh, yeah, certainly. I mean, you know, you come out of college and you know, success is to go get a decent paying job, right? Hopefully, in something that you're passionate about. And the interesting thing is I wasn't passionate about what I did in the aerospace industry, but and at the same time I found it very challenging, which is what I did like. Um, you know, so success definitely changes, you know, that's is it about money, is it about lifestyle, is it about fulfillment? Right? Are you enjoying what you're doing? And are you living the life that you were meant to live? And so, yes, success change, has changed, and will most likely probably change as time goes on.

SPEAKER_01 12:26

It's like seasons of life, right? Like we we use a different measuring stick for every one of those seasons. And uh, you're right that it even like if I take a pause today and look at my definition of success, I'm sure in just a matter of a few years it'll be different, right? So it's something that we're always working with, and that's why I do this podcast because uh we as practitioners we're more the same than we are different in many ways, and we have the same motivations and the same challenges and obstacles that we face as well. So I think clearly getting a definition or a working definition of where you stand today and the things that make you fulfilled, it's one of the most powerful things you can do because then every day you could collect evidence that, hey, I I am getting those things right now. Too many times we just get lost in the like rigmarole of practice and don't really make it out, right? So uh I know you take everything you've learned through those phases of your life and apply it, and you you dive into detail with people and you you really like dig deep to get them health transformations. Is there a practice lesson that stands out to you most?

SPEAKER_00 13:29

What do you mean by a practice lesson?

SPEAKER_01 13:31

Like, is there anything that you learned from working with somebody that like completely changed your view on how people get better?

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Yes. Um, I don't know that it was like one you know true pivotal point. But what I've learned, um, and I and it just became reinforced again in the last couple months, and from a different perspective, it's funny how it comes in, is that we really need to work with the whole person. Um, you know, we can focus on the physical side of you know what's going on with the body, what's functioning, what's not functioning, what's in there that doesn't need to be in there, you know, how do we safely get that out of there? Um, but you know, it all comes down to it, doesn't it, you you want to incorporate the whole person because mindset matters. You know, what we think and what we're telling ourselves matters a lot, and we don't realize that we may not be speaking out loud, but that little voice in our head turns really, really fast, much faster than we speak. And even when we're speaking, we're we're reinforcing it because we're hearing what we're saying. So mindset matters, um, you know, also realizing that we are an emotional body and an energetic body. And uh, when I talk about the emotional side, I'm looking at things like uh there's a book called The Body Keeps the Score, and what that goes into is how we will trap negative emotional energy on a cellular level from physical or emotional traumas. And they don't have to be these big major traumas, they can be little micro traumas, and so that can disrupt how the body works. And there's there's techniques out there, and I went out and learned one of them so that I could help my clients release that trapped energy, uh, emotional energy. And then we also have an energy body. We're all connected energetically, and we're all connected to source in some form or fashion. And sometimes there's blocks in the energy field, right? Or there's you know, some sort of, you know, there's there's different energy attachments, and realizing that, and there's not always a specific order for people. Everybody's different, every journey is different, each session is different with a client. Um, and to address all of those, and and the recent epiphany was just reinforcing that you know, if if it's nervous system, is it dysregulated or is it regulated? And if we're in fight or flight mode, even like a little bit, um, that takes us away from the parasympathetic, which is the rest and restore, repair, uh, digest mode. Any of the protocols are will be compromised to some degree if we're in fight or flight, because the body's not going to receive them. And so, back to answering the question is one of the things I've started doing is what can I do to help this person calm their nervous system, even at the beginning of a session, so that we can make better products.

SPEAKER_01 16:34

And I feel like that's such a big block for a lot of practitioners because, including myself, like working with many people, uh, it was something that I felt I couldn't access, or I wasn't like qualified, I guess might be the right word, or didn't have enough training to be able to access it in a meaningful way. So I find it's uh definitely a neglected area, and a lot of us go through that mindset shift when we see people getting better, but not as better as we hoped for them, right? And we kind of start to like pull the pull the layers back of the onion and peel the layers back, and we're like, okay, what's going on? What's going on deeper here? So I absolutely love that, and I I love that you're going beyond just the functional foundation. So, uh, how has your practice approach evolved over the years? Like, I know when we all first jump into this world, what I always teach any practitioner I work with is nothing will teach you more than working with your first client. Uh, so we start working, but it's usually a lot of like what we learned in in like the didactic course or certification program or or anything that we took, where it's like, okay, these are the set of problems, these are the set of nutritional steps we can do, these are the lifestyle steps we could do, these are the supplements we can use, right? But beyond that, that's kind of where the buck stops, and even supplements have a lot of nuance as well. Like, have you noticed your your practice approach has evolved over the years?

SPEAKER_00 17:54

It definitely has. You know, by bringing in some of those other tools, um, and and I did I started to do some of that just based on feedback from other practitioners going to the conferences, listening to what you know they've learned and what helps with them. And you know, another uh piece to that is, and I learned this in my own journey, and I continue to relearn it. Timing is everything, right? You can have the best protocol or energy release or whatever the case may be. Is it the right time for that client? Right? And sometimes you'll try something and it doesn't work, and it doesn't mean put it doesn't mean get rid of it forever, it means just put it on the back burner because I've seen where something wasn't getting the results, took it out, and then bring it back in later at a different time, and all of a sudden what you're hoping for for your client begins to occur. So remembering that, and sometimes we have to go back and redo things we've done. So that's the hard part because we'll we'll do something and it doesn't work, so we'll write it off. And it's like don't do that, just keep it to the side. Uh, because you never know how this journey is gonna go.

SPEAKER_01 19:06

Oh, I love that, and it's a great analogy, right? It's kind of like building a house when you think about it. If you uh you start laying the drywall as the first step, there's nothing holding that drywall up. It doesn't mean the drywall is not needed, it's it is needed, right? But uh, that's actually a lesson I used to teach practitioners very early on when I used to focus more clinically on the training, is like the order in which you do stuff matters, right? The sequence of steps that you take. If you take like think of a car wash, if you put the soap on last and then just drive off, like it's out of sequence, right? You're not gonna get the result you're looking for. So it's uh it's so so powerful. And this is where I get to see the psychology of practitioners and the way that they operate, and I learn a lot from them as well, because this is where I see your engineer brain ticking, also, and how you're able to map these components out and connect the dots and and almost see stuff like a schematic in front of you as well, right? Um so getting into like more of the mindset piece because I know that that's your baby, that's something that um I've even worked with you on in many respects. Uh, and Ken is absolutely wonderful at that. He's helped me find root blocks and things that are going on with me, and it's something I'm continuing to explore with him. Uh, is there a belief or model that you had early on in practice that you feel you've outgrown?

SPEAKER_00 20:26

That's a good question. I have to think about that because there's been so much shift and changes. Um, one thing, so the lifestyle work, you know, I purposely went on a journey years ago for personal growth, and that's where a lot of what I do, some of what I do comes from, uh comes from for people. Um but there's other stuff that I just never saw coming. Um, you know, I I never saw the learning the emotion code technique coming. Um I never saw the and some of these things I didn't seek out, I believe I was sought out in the way that things came about, you know, doing some of the energy work um, you know, with people with energy blockages that they have. And so there, you know, you're asking about you know a shift from the beginning. Yeah, one of them is that when I started, because uh what I went through was, you know, everything was you know usually some sort of supplement based. And you know, the when I first started coaching, I was using a different program than I am now. And it was focused too much on the supplements when I look back at it. Because really, supplements are a tool, right? They're not, it's not a supplement program. The supplements are part of a program. And to bring the other stuff in, um, yeah, and I really like the energy piece, and it's interesting because there's an intuitive part to that, which I'm I'm still becoming more comfortable with, let's put it that way. Of just, and that means stepping out completely out of the engineering brain to be able to go with the intuitive, what am I being guided to do with this person? And and that's that's also to do that properly, you need to give up control, right? And a lot of us in some ways we're trying to control something in our life. And the reality is the only control we really have at the end of the day is how we choose to respond to any given situation. That's really the only thing we can control. So, you know, letting go of that control, stepping into that intuitive world, and it's an interesting blend because I've learned how been trained how to muscle test. Actually, a practitioner trained me how to test myself years ago, and like decades ago. And um blending those and using the knowledge to ask the right questions to do the testing, then also then trusting in your intuition. So it's all it's very interesting how things will go when I work with people.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

Wow. It's actually something that I've been mulling over in my head in terms of a framework, and it's hard to put into words, it's hard to put into something tangible. So that's why you said you got to sometimes put the engineer brain away and see what I'm guided to do. But it looks like you're blending science, intuition, and connection into your work as well. And I feel like that's I was gonna say practitioner 2.0, but it's actually like practitioner 10.0, right? And that only comes with the experience you have. So if anyone's listening to today's podcast and thinking about working with Ken, this is what you'll be experiencing. Working with them, it's not just a single layer and it's uh how things connect. And um, yeah, I always think back. I'm like, I wish I had met Coach Ken when I was going through my stuff uh many, many years ago. You I probably would have got a faster result because there's there's layers that I only accessed years after the fact, right? And there's so many things going on there. So I love that. Now, one thing we're big on here is building community, and I feel it's one of my missions is that people who are suffering from health problems they're the loneliest people ever. Uh, and it's a very lonely road, and people don't understand them, and this is where they don't get along with family members, and it's just tough for them all around. Um, how are you incorporating community or group healing into your models?

SPEAKER_00 24:17

Good question. Um, well, one way, what the primary way is working with you in that you know, putting this group program together. I I uh I'm really excited about getting that launched. Um because I do understand the value of people getting better in groups and why community really matters. And it's it's a win-win across the board. Uh clients do better. Um it and and in true transparency, I can offer them a better price if we're doing a group versus one-on-one. And they may be even getting more benefit because a lot of the knowledge that I share is being recorded, and I'm actually going to take that into my one-on-ones and have that set up where they have these recordings. It does a couple things, right? As practitioners, in all honesty, we're saying the same thing over and over, and and we're not always remembering who we told what detail. So you get all that recorded and out there, and now you know all of your clients are getting the same information relative to lifestyle, relative to toxin avoids, relative to certain things and how the body works. Um, so I'm really excited about that because it's a way to serve more people in a shorter period of time. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 25:34

One of the best ways to grow your impact. I always think about like when people are going through something like that. Like you wouldn't want to go to a movie theater by yourself. Like, there's probably a few of you out there, but for most people, like part of the enjoyment of going to the movies to watch a movie is like to have the emotional connection with people and react the same way, laugh to the same thing, uh, jump scare to the same thing. So that you wouldn't want to be the only student in like a university or college class. So it's just you and the professor on the other side, right? So we already do this and across all like walks of life. You wouldn't want to be the only hockey or basketball player on the field or on the on the arena, right? Floor. So it's something that is so innate in us, but then when we try to take in health information, we're taking it in alone. So I love that. And this is where practitioners can give their best self to each and every person that they work with. Because it's tough if you're only working one-on-one to just give everybody like every little thing you know. There's just not enough time for that. There's too many touch points for you. But when you leverage yourself and you build out a community model, it just changes the game. And uh, it really helps on the other side of the table, as you mentioned, from an affordability standpoint, a practicality standpoint, and most importantly, you learn things that you probably otherwise wouldn't have learned and learn how to apply them in a meaningful way as well. So that's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

That's a good point because I do learn from my clients. I certainly don't know everything and don't expect that I will ever know everything. Um, and clients will come to me with things that I don't know about, and so they'll you know, tell me what they know about it, and then I'll look that up, and then you get in the groups, and then you also have that, you know, one person has walked the journey, and it's also and it's different hearing it from them than it is hearing it from me, uh the person that it's landing with. So it's it's it's a it's definitely a win-win.

SPEAKER_01 27:25

Yeah, sometimes it's it's the who, right, that tells you something and not necessarily the what. So uh it's like your parents have probably been telling you something your entire as a teenager your entire life. Like, don't do that, don't do that. But as soon as a friend tells you, you're gonna listen, right? So yeah, that's that's an important thing. And yeah, we're always learning, and uh, I absolutely love that. Going to like how you learn and and kind of the habits that you have uh overall, like are there any habits that you have that kind of keep you grounded and clear through the day as you're working with clients?

SPEAKER_00 27:57

Yeah, and it's you know, even as you know, health coaches and either and even practitioners out there, sometimes you know, we fall out of our own routines that we know work for us. And you know, this time of year, Texas is pretty darn darn hot. So going out for that morning walk and catching as much of the early morning sun as possible just to get out, you know, I I don't take a cell phone with me, right? I'm not I don't have any earbuds in or anything. I'm going out, I'm going for a walk, and just enjoying the sunshine, getting the blood flowing, you know, that sort of thing. And then I also most mornings I either do some energy work with clients remotely, um, or and or my own meditation in the morning. And it's only I may only like the walk, it's about 20 minutes and maybe five minutes of meditation, maybe another five if I'm gonna work with some some clients, um with a little bit of stuff, and uh you know that helps because I'm accessing you know source energy, God's energy when I'm doing that. So that helps me stay centered, and you know, being out in nature helps me stay centered. Getting out of the you know, I work from home. Um so finding a reason to get out and go for a walk in the morning is a good thing. So there there are those things, and then you know, whether I go do any other exercise during the day, or you know, even because it is so hot, um, you know, I live in a town home, so I will actually do the stairs during during the middle of the day, you know, at pace, up and down the stair, because there's two flights of stairs. Um, you know, just to because we sit, right? And a lot of us do with our jobs. Um, and so building it's building the little things in. Um, you know, blocking out an hour to go to the gym is great, you know, but these other things that are just 20 minutes here and there are something we can really literally do anytime during the day.

SPEAKER_01 29:49

Absolutely. It doesn't take a lot, and I think that's the lesson I'm learning from interviewing practitioners as well, is uh I love to get into their psychology and their daily habits. And if I have to use a term to describe what they do, they essentially use microhabits, right? They do these things that don't take up a lot of time, but the ROI on that time investment is massive. And I find a lot of practitioners they hit burnout because they usually start their day in a stressed-out state and more of a sympathetic state, and then they're back to back to back to back to back to back, and the the structure of their day, and then maybe one hour they're being pulled to do something else that's completely unrelated to their client calls, and it's just kind of all over the place. So we need to protect our energy, we're energetic beings at the end of the day. So if uh we don't apply these, um you might get to a point where you have to apply them, and there's no other choice for you. So uh I think we all learn one way or another. So implementing these and and using strategies that other practitioners are are actually implementing, that's huge. And I know, Ken, you're doing a lot of energy work as well, so you have great incentive to protect your own energy, I'm assuming as well.

SPEAKER_00 30:57

Yeah, and that's an interesting concept, too. That you know, I when I first started doing energy releases, um had one of them go through me. I was I do a lot of distance work, and um actually most of what I do is distance. I do have some in-person hours. And um I felt the energy release came through me because during those, you know, the person doing it, like I become the surrogate, and I didn't like that at all. And I've watched other practitioners, I've seen them do that, and I've and watched them have to shake it off or cough it out or whatever the case may be. And I'm fortunate to have found a holistic practitioners community here, and people have been working with energy for their whole lives, and you know, there was this thought of you know, you put a shield up, right, to protect yourself. Well, we really don't want to do that because by putting the shield up, we actually invite something to come push against it. Ah which is a little counterintuitive, but when you think about it, you know, it's like okay, because you know now you've set up this conflict. And what I learned was to simply be the light, just be the light while you're doing it. Don't think about I have to protect myself, and because the light will will naturally you're putting the light out, and so that's not leaving room for really anything to come in. And it doesn't say it doesn't happen, because you need you know it's about being centered when you do this, um, and really tapping in. And so it's really just being the light. And usually uh I don't every now and then I do have to check in, but I usually don't carry things from other people after a session. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:39

That's a a Yoda level skill. And I guess the the pendulum swings both ways. I never thought of it like that because uh most of what we're taught by training programs and and hearing from other practitioners is to put that shield up, right? So that's one side of the pendulum. The other side of the pendulum is like keeping yourself completely wide open and like not having anything there. So I guess I would think I was leaning more toward the protection side, but the pendulum, you said it perfectly, it has to be centered, right? So you have to remain centered in these. And yeah, I I these are skills, like I just always go back and I'm like, I wish my younger self knew these things. I wish I yeah. If if you could go back and uh teach your younger self a piece of advice or instill some sort of knowledge that you have now, is is there any singular thing that stands out to you?

SPEAKER_00 33:32

Well, there's a lot of things I could teach my could have taught my younger self, could have avoided a lot of pain, although from some of that pain is you know what how you learn. Um, you know, I look back at you know, like engineering, you know, doing those things, there was, you know, controlling things, controlling men to be in a good way, um, and pushing on things. And what I so we have these things called winning formulas that we learn when we're younger, right? A couple stages of our early life where we'll win, like, what do we do that works really well? You know, and mine was I can get things done. The problem is, this actually came with one of this funny what's coming back, came in one of my reviews when I worked at in the aerospace industry was um the challenge was it was the lead follower, get the hell out of the way attitude. And you know, that's where when we approach things that way, we've shut ourselves off to other things that we haven't thought about, other inputs besides actually you know rubbing people the wrong way. Um and you know, that would be the thing, and I was thinking, and and for almost everybody, it's like when we're myopic on things, we we're not allowing the wisdom to come in. Right? And that's and the wisdom's out there, and we never know where the wisdom's gonna come from. Just like you said, our parents could be telling us something. People plant seeds and someone else may water them. So I look at if I can if I plant seeds, I'm at this person that at least has that going forward. Maybe someone else will come along and water them. So it's it's just being more open in realizing that um you can get. I accomplished a lot of things. This is very energetic at work, and I think back of could I have done that same amount of energy, but back off some of the intensity of it and and do it more with more enjoyment, but still accomplish it. And that's one of the things I would look at. Yeah, and I remind myself of that today, too.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

That's huge. Like I reflect back and I'm like, you know what? That's something that I wish I knew as well. It's uh being present in that moment and uh not being so so intense as you mentioned it, right? It's uh it every moment is passing us, right? So we need to make sure we're present, we're in the moment, we're able to take in what we're supposed to learn in that moment and what we're supposed to guide uh in that moment as well. So that's absolutely huge, right? We all need to be more grounded at every time in our life, but uh, I know the younger we are, typically the harder it is to do that as well.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:13

Kind of going into like where you see the future. So I know like we've talked about your career trajectory, we've talked about the changes you've made, we've talked about the way your mindset has changed and now how you work with people has changed and evolved over time. Do you see any trends right now that are kind of shaping the future of natural healthcare and how do you plan to evolve with them?

SPEAKER_00 36:35

It's a good question. There's just information is just coming at us left and right with you know AI coming into play, and it's a great tool, and we're just we're inundated. The question, you know, one of the challenges, and I'm not necessarily answering your question right now, but one of the challenges is there is so much information being generated, it's hard to know what's valid information and what's not these days. Um, and then what's trendy and what's not trendy. You know, there's things out there with peptides now. I'm not going to go into detail, and I'm listening to some of the other experts going, we really don't know what we're setting ourselves up for with this stuff. Um, you know, so for going forward, yeah, that's it's hard to say where thing where things are going. It's I like to, you know, when these things come out and these fads come out, and not all of them are fads, I don't mean to be sound so negative on that. Um it I like to see how it plays out before I I start recommending anything to my clients. Um, you know, let's see, okay, what does it look like two years from now, right? Was this really the answer that they were promoting? Um, you know, where do I it's so much is evolving. And the thing about it is keeping in mind that it evolves. Science is not static. What was true 20 years ago is not necessarily true today. And to remember that we're constantly learning, our bodies are super complex. We boil them down into as simple as possible so we can understand them. Um the reality is we're gonna keep is to keep learning and keep refining. Um you know, to just help people actually live healthy lives. It's you know, we're we may have increased lifespan, but I'm more concerned about health span.

SPEAKER_01 38:21

Great point, absolutely. And I feel like we've added a lot of complexity to things as well, like especially with like how people get better and like the advice that people are recommended, and with this complexity, like people are actually forgetting the foundations, unfortunately. So you mentioned peptides, and it's one of those things where yes, okay, they've shown some positive benefit, but a lot of people who go toward those peptides, they're they're usually not doing the foundations really well. And what happens when the pepsa peptide cycle runs out or comes to a conclusion, is the the person hasn't changed at all, right? It's kind of like that funny story of lottery winners who they have the same identity before and after winning the lottery. So most lottery winners are broke X amount of time after winning the lottery, right? It's it's uh very, very similar. And I think the other big point you made there, and I'm I'm completely on board with this, it's one of my missions as well, is um there's so much out there now from an information standpoint, but there's no fact-checking necessarily, there's no confirming, and you're absolutely right. Like when we reflect back something that is a scientific discovery today, we might think of it differently in 20 years. So I'm not saying be skeptical, I'm not saying don't trust the science, but know that science is something that it improves over time. So just even think about some of the breakthroughs over the last few years. Uh, I know the Alzheimer's plaque hypothesis was uh debunked not too long ago, right? And what does that mean? That means the last, I don't know how long, decade of uh Alzheimer's research was based on the incorrect hypothesis and theories, uh, which means everything that they've arrived at hypothetically doesn't work. So it's it's one of those, right? And uh that's the scientific method is that you improve upon things as you get forward. So uh for practitioners listening in, like I think there's a lot of value in like sticking to the foundations, but then also knowing those pieces of timeless wisdom that you know can help people. And then you said the word best can, and I think you're you're you're somebody who I feel has um had a great deal of uh evolution in this this category is intuition, right? It's uh trusting your intuition, and it's something that's so abstract, it's hard to put into words, but like it's it's what happens when you when you meet a client, right? This is why I I feel uh AI is not necessarily going to replace every little thing that everybody does. There's a a layer to you that only you can offer. So definitely stay in that light and keep shining that light bright.

SPEAKER_00 40:44

Well, thank you. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'd love to know Al-Ba you brought up a good point I want to touch on real quick, and that is going back to the basics. Um, I'll find myself sometimes starting to go down a rabbit hole with a client, and it's just step back and go, what are the basics? How does how does the body work, right? In general. Um, you know, we can go too deep in the weeds and it's coming back to simple things. You know, is the drainage funnel open, right? We're trying to do something, you help a client with something. Um you know, but oh wait, there's something the drainage funnel isn't working correctly. Well, that's gonna cause so it is we tend to want to overcomplicate things. And what I've found is if you keep it simple, um it's easy for me to understand, so it's easier for me to explain it to my clients and and to to always check on the basics, you know, when things are starting to go a little sideways.

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Yeah, definitely. Sometimes we put over reliance on like a supplement or something that you're doing, but you might have your diet go out the window for a full week and then wonder like why things aren't moving as well as they were, right? So it's uh something we can lose focus of very, very quickly. So I I've loved our conversation today. I I love the way that you approach things as well. What's next for you? What's kind of lighting you up right now?

SPEAKER_00 42:04

What is lighting me up? I've been so busy working on my business, um, and I'm still doing that. Um it's you know, it's it's getting this the group program further along and formally launched, um, you know, and actually getting that everything's in place, other than except for you know, working on, okay, as practitioners, our most of us our least favorite is marketing, I'll be honest. And there's sometimes where we just need to reach out and get help with that. And so it's I'm pretty, I'm really close to having enough stuff done to like let's start pushing the marketing now and let's start rolling this out. Um, and then I'm thinking that's gonna give me a chance to breathe, but we'll find out.

SPEAKER_01 42:48

Yeah, I know uh having a practice and writing a practice, it's uh it's never uneventful. And we're we're always trying to improve ourselves and we're always trying to impact more people. So I I love that you're approaching it uh grounded and with grace. So I'm uh I'm foreseeing big things for you in the very near future here as well. Uh for our listeners, where can they go to learn more about you?

SPEAKER_00 43:10

Okay, they can go. So the name of my business is rabbit hole health coaching. Um, because yes, my health journey felt like going down a rabbit hole. And you know, I I help bring people up from the rabbit hole. Ideally, I'd like to help people from going down the rabbit hole in the first place. Um, and so you can go to rabbit holehealthcoaching.com and in rabbit hole health coaching on Facebook and Instagram, and yes, there's room for improvement on the marketing, I'll be transparent with that. Um one of the latest tasks was having a new website built to go with you know more of the refining of the message, the different programs that I offer. Um, and you can schedule a what I call a your path forward call. It's a complimentary call. Let's just see what you have going on, see if I'm the right person to help you. Uh, if not, I will do my best to find someone to help you.

SPEAKER_01 44:03

Amazing. Well, this applies to any practitioner listening and any non-practitioner listening as well. Definitely check out Ken's website and his social media, and you'll see that he's quite humble. And uh probably not speaking about all the hard work he's put into it uh as openly, but I know he's done an amazing job, and you guys will love what he's created. So definitely go give him some love and uh a follow and uh a like. So super appreciate you today, uh Coach Ken. It's been an absolute pleasure and honor, and I can't wait to see the continued impact you have in this world.

SPEAKER_00 44:35

All right, Ricky, thank you so much. Oh, my pleasure.